Well said. But the Romans didn't invent the salute often ascribed to them. It's a modern myth. The origin is thought to be in a 1748 painting "The oath of the Horati", and re-interpreted by Mussolini into what has become a symbol of fascism.
I'd thought the same until I did the research...the travails of being an anthropologist who works in the digital realms! Enjoyed your book and your writings. Much appreciated insights.
Yes, Giles Crouch is right about the painting by Jacques-Louis David, but more precisely: the Roman salut was invented and became popular in some Italian kolossal movies like " Quo Vadis" (1913) and "Cabiria" (1914). Then it was used by Gabriele D'Annunzio, an Italian poet and officer - who also was one of the screenwriter of "Cabiria". His ideas and esthetics influenced fascism and Mussolini who officially adopted the salut in 1925.
Genuinely refreshing to not read yet another don't worry, here's how to resist, be hopeful, not negative, pile of steaming useless crap. Things are bad and we need to understand how bad things are and not just sign one more stinking petition, every day, that goes nowhere, remember to breathe and vote again someday if an election is allowed.
Yeah, thanks — I know the headline especially is a little aggressive, but I mean it in the sense that he's performing that role, the victor beyond reproach, and that's how the tech titans are feeling right now; they're flexing their power. I do not think we're helpless before it by any means, but yes — it's bad.
I would add that it has another function - aside from being a "dog whistle" to actual Nazis. And that other function is "mainstreaming".
It’s a deliberate trolling gesture that is done specifically to bring Nazi language and symbolism just a little bit closer to being "normal".
Elon knows that the left will deride it, the sad remains of the media will report it, and that his army of "useful idiots" will excuse it.
But it’s not normal—at least, not yet. But it will be unless we actively oppose it.
Unfortunately, as people without our own social networks, there is little we can do to challenge this effectively online. What we CAN do, however, is talk directly with our friends and relatives who are trying to pass this off as "just Elon being enthusiastic."
A coalition of nations outside traditional hegemonic power structures could fundamentally rewrite the rules of accountability. Through coordinated international sanctions, they could target not just the ultra-wealthy but the entire scaffolding of enablers—CEOs, executives, and board members—who uphold systems of unchecked influence.
Freeze their assets, restrict their movements, and dismantle the networks that allow such power to thrive. This isn’t just about holding one individual accountable; it’s about eroding the very foundation that enables oligarchic dominance. Real change begins when the consequences ripple through every level of complicity.
Excellent piece. I’ve been hating all the sanewashing, excuse-making, and either-or bullshit in the MSM when it comes to this pack of broligarchs. Plus, considering Musk’s family history, the Sieg Heil is practically in his DNA.
Yes. Musk has the social capital to burn. Now, if everything else ends up burning, that probably won't stand. And his antics won't fly nearly as well with current supporters.
Elon Musk has been supporting a commie Chinese regime that conducts live human organ harvesting, est. from studies suggest anywhere from 50K~150K humans are butchered—alive—for their organs every year and that for the last 20 years….
BUT THANKS for your outrage about the autist spastic jerking his arm in the air because of some bullshit about a regime that was defeated 70 years ago….
Thank you!! Sometimes, it doesn’t matter the intent of the gesture (we will likely never know the true intentions). What matters is that an incredibly powerful man got up in front of the world and gave what looked like a god damned Nazi salute. That’s what it looked like, Elon Musk knows that is what it looked like, and so do the fucking neo Nazis.
Yes, and he’s the grandchild of Nazis. His grandparents moved to South Africa because they were big fans of apartheid. There is no way in fuck that asshole didn’t know *exactly* what he was signaling.
Brian, you are groping at the thinnest of straws, Watching the video it is clear that he is, though in his awkward way, saying "you all in the audience have my heart" (or something to that effect) to which he even points to his heart after he does it.
Did I like it, no, it was freaking awkward, but most of Elon's interviews and speeches are.
Your warnings on technology in other posts are well merited, but this one is too partisan and trivial and when politics grasps at these straws, and intelligent people parrot it, the legitimacy of the rest of the argument is called into question. This is why traditional media, based on its viewership numbers, is becoming irrelevant. And that is why I bring it up here, since we, as non- traditional media writers, have the capacity to amplify the conversation, not succumb to its bias’ weaknesses.
Two more points to make about this.
First, there are now numerous imagery, across social media, of democratic leaders, including Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris making the same hand gesture. Are you willing to admit they they too are part of the faction? I wouldn’t consider them giving the signal, anymore than I would Elon. That is what intelligent people realize. So when grasping at straws for the sake of a point, again, the legitimate point is now questioned, and everything written, past and present, is then filtered through that lens.
Second, I'd love your stance on the tens of thousands of people, on college campuses, actually holding banners that exclaim that the jewish race should be wiped off the map; their comments about the "evil zionists," and the attack of actual jewish people on college campuses, and out on the streets. Nazism isn't a freaking salute, it's an ideology of hatred, perversion and death - that is the standard by which to measure an event. By that standard, you should be far more adamant with your concern about those on college campuses than a weird hand signal by a man with awkward and uncomfortable motions anyway.
Thanks for the empathetic and nuanced explanation rich with logic and reason. Great promo for your point of view. Who became the hater that quickly? Oh well. I’ll leave now. Not worth it.
have you seen the original videos of the 'same hand gestures' Harris and Clinton did? you're literally mindlessly repeating whatever you probably saw on X, and let me tell you that only 1 of the 3 vids mentioned by you are 1 to 1 a nazi salute, which probably isn't a coincidence because how is that even possible to accidentally hit that is beyond me, and let's stop acting as if he wasn't sympathizing with nazis on his platform constantly...
I like it Svein-Gunnar, and much better than just “FO” - and if you want content much deeper than a C-, feel free to check out https://rethinkerpub.substack.com have a great day! (young people are young…. lol)
There is a vast difference between a naysayer and skeptic. I could absolutely respect your way of presenting your thoughts, and yeah, the veil wasn’t that thin… lol.
I’ll check it out Svein-Gunnar, and thanks, we probably have some stuff to learn from each other.
I’ve watched them all. And none of them including musk, were doing that. I’m not parroting anything, this is a straw man argument and intelligent people see right through it. Had the right, of which I am not, taken a shot and spun it the same way with say Hillary, the left would have called anyone who spoke of it that way as nuts. I didn’t say it was nuts, I said it was flimsy as an argument and awkward as a gesture.
Did either Harris or Clinton bite their lips like naughty children who are just SO EXCITED to be bad little trolls? TWICE? DO either of them promote pro-nazi accounts on social media? Meet with extreme right wing leaders like the AfD? The longer you wear the mask, the harder it is to remove.
Plus, also- your substack looks like an AI mash up between myspace and LinkedIn. Sad.
Well said. But the Romans didn't invent the salute often ascribed to them. It's a modern myth. The origin is thought to be in a 1748 painting "The oath of the Horati", and re-interpreted by Mussolini into what has become a symbol of fascism.
Thank you! That's fascinating — was just kind of snarkily parroting what I saw going around online, hadn't looked into it much.
I'd thought the same until I did the research...the travails of being an anthropologist who works in the digital realms! Enjoyed your book and your writings. Much appreciated insights.
Yes, Giles Crouch is right about the painting by Jacques-Louis David, but more precisely: the Roman salut was invented and became popular in some Italian kolossal movies like " Quo Vadis" (1913) and "Cabiria" (1914). Then it was used by Gabriele D'Annunzio, an Italian poet and officer - who also was one of the screenwriter of "Cabiria". His ideas and esthetics influenced fascism and Mussolini who officially adopted the salut in 1925.
More info: https://www.jstor.org/stable/j.ctv1x67ddf
Genuinely refreshing to not read yet another don't worry, here's how to resist, be hopeful, not negative, pile of steaming useless crap. Things are bad and we need to understand how bad things are and not just sign one more stinking petition, every day, that goes nowhere, remember to breathe and vote again someday if an election is allowed.
Yeah, thanks — I know the headline especially is a little aggressive, but I mean it in the sense that he's performing that role, the victor beyond reproach, and that's how the tech titans are feeling right now; they're flexing their power. I do not think we're helpless before it by any means, but yes — it's bad.
I would add that it has another function - aside from being a "dog whistle" to actual Nazis. And that other function is "mainstreaming".
It’s a deliberate trolling gesture that is done specifically to bring Nazi language and symbolism just a little bit closer to being "normal".
Elon knows that the left will deride it, the sad remains of the media will report it, and that his army of "useful idiots" will excuse it.
But it’s not normal—at least, not yet. But it will be unless we actively oppose it.
Unfortunately, as people without our own social networks, there is little we can do to challenge this effectively online. What we CAN do, however, is talk directly with our friends and relatives who are trying to pass this off as "just Elon being enthusiastic."
Good points.
They need to feel fear.
We need to kill nazis again.
After all... we celebrate it.
A coalition of nations outside traditional hegemonic power structures could fundamentally rewrite the rules of accountability. Through coordinated international sanctions, they could target not just the ultra-wealthy but the entire scaffolding of enablers—CEOs, executives, and board members—who uphold systems of unchecked influence.
Freeze their assets, restrict their movements, and dismantle the networks that allow such power to thrive. This isn’t just about holding one individual accountable; it’s about eroding the very foundation that enables oligarchic dominance. Real change begins when the consequences ripple through every level of complicity.
Thank You Brian
Appalling!
Excellent piece. I’ve been hating all the sanewashing, excuse-making, and either-or bullshit in the MSM when it comes to this pack of broligarchs. Plus, considering Musk’s family history, the Sieg Heil is practically in his DNA.
They ... the nazis .... need to feel fear.
He did it. Yall can deny it. It's silly to deny it. Why would you?
Practice up. It'll be a dance next month.
Yes. Musk has the social capital to burn. Now, if everything else ends up burning, that probably won't stand. And his antics won't fly nearly as well with current supporters.
Elon Musk has been supporting a commie Chinese regime that conducts live human organ harvesting, est. from studies suggest anywhere from 50K~150K humans are butchered—alive—for their organs every year and that for the last 20 years….
BUT THANKS for your outrage about the autist spastic jerking his arm in the air because of some bullshit about a regime that was defeated 70 years ago….
yeah…. very, very, very serious criticisms
smfh
Yep the guy is an infantile, spoilt twat - end of.
Thank you!! Sometimes, it doesn’t matter the intent of the gesture (we will likely never know the true intentions). What matters is that an incredibly powerful man got up in front of the world and gave what looked like a god damned Nazi salute. That’s what it looked like, Elon Musk knows that is what it looked like, and so do the fucking neo Nazis.
Yes, and he’s the grandchild of Nazis. His grandparents moved to South Africa because they were big fans of apartheid. There is no way in fuck that asshole didn’t know *exactly* what he was signaling.
Fuck Musk .
Brian, you are groping at the thinnest of straws, Watching the video it is clear that he is, though in his awkward way, saying "you all in the audience have my heart" (or something to that effect) to which he even points to his heart after he does it.
Did I like it, no, it was freaking awkward, but most of Elon's interviews and speeches are.
Your warnings on technology in other posts are well merited, but this one is too partisan and trivial and when politics grasps at these straws, and intelligent people parrot it, the legitimacy of the rest of the argument is called into question. This is why traditional media, based on its viewership numbers, is becoming irrelevant. And that is why I bring it up here, since we, as non- traditional media writers, have the capacity to amplify the conversation, not succumb to its bias’ weaknesses.
Two more points to make about this.
First, there are now numerous imagery, across social media, of democratic leaders, including Hillary Clinton and Kamala Harris making the same hand gesture. Are you willing to admit they they too are part of the faction? I wouldn’t consider them giving the signal, anymore than I would Elon. That is what intelligent people realize. So when grasping at straws for the sake of a point, again, the legitimate point is now questioned, and everything written, past and present, is then filtered through that lens.
Second, I'd love your stance on the tens of thousands of people, on college campuses, actually holding banners that exclaim that the jewish race should be wiped off the map; their comments about the "evil zionists," and the attack of actual jewish people on college campuses, and out on the streets. Nazism isn't a freaking salute, it's an ideology of hatred, perversion and death - that is the standard by which to measure an event. By that standard, you should be far more adamant with your concern about those on college campuses than a weird hand signal by a man with awkward and uncomfortable motions anyway.
BS. FO with your shitty apologia for a drug addict oligarch.
Thanks for the empathetic and nuanced explanation rich with logic and reason. Great promo for your point of view. Who became the hater that quickly? Oh well. I’ll leave now. Not worth it.
lol. ok nazi sympathizer.
have you seen the original videos of the 'same hand gestures' Harris and Clinton did? you're literally mindlessly repeating whatever you probably saw on X, and let me tell you that only 1 of the 3 vids mentioned by you are 1 to 1 a nazi salute, which probably isn't a coincidence because how is that even possible to accidentally hit that is beyond me, and let's stop acting as if he wasn't sympathizing with nazis on his platform constantly...
Let’s see how you scored:
+1 for strawman argumentation (+2 bonus for accusing your opponent of using a strawman).
+2 for the number of individuals mentioned in a classic "whatabout-ism."
+1 For pointing out that young people in universities are young.
Final Grade: C-
Pretty decent, but you can do better.
I like it Svein-Gunnar, and much better than just “FO” - and if you want content much deeper than a C-, feel free to check out https://rethinkerpub.substack.com have a great day! (young people are young…. lol)
That is a good answer :)
I can respect when people take a veiled insult and roll with it, so I will check it out. You may want to do the same in my direction.
Based on the title of your Substack, I suspect we might find common ground on this post: https://backtobasic.substack.com/p/some-grown-ups-apparently-still-have
There is a vast difference between a naysayer and skeptic. I could absolutely respect your way of presenting your thoughts, and yeah, the veil wasn’t that thin… lol.
I’ll check it out Svein-Gunnar, and thanks, we probably have some stuff to learn from each other.
Wow.
I’ve watched them all. And none of them including musk, were doing that. I’m not parroting anything, this is a straw man argument and intelligent people see right through it. Had the right, of which I am not, taken a shot and spun it the same way with say Hillary, the left would have called anyone who spoke of it that way as nuts. I didn’t say it was nuts, I said it was flimsy as an argument and awkward as a gesture.
Did either Harris or Clinton bite their lips like naughty children who are just SO EXCITED to be bad little trolls? TWICE? DO either of them promote pro-nazi accounts on social media? Meet with extreme right wing leaders like the AfD? The longer you wear the mask, the harder it is to remove.
Plus, also- your substack looks like an AI mash up between myspace and LinkedIn. Sad.
Hahaha everything is nazi!
I'll take your word for it. You seem to be the kind of person who intimately knows nazi-esque consciousness.
no, just retarded like both you and Elon.